Alan Babbitt: Welcome to the Hope College Athletics Orange and Blue Podcast. My name is Alan Babbitt, the sports information director here at Hope College. It's been my pleasure this school year to chat with Hope College coaches and staff as we navigate this certainly interesting, to say the least the 2020-21 school year. With me today is head men's lacrosse coach Michael Schanhals. Coach, welcome to the podcast.
Michael Schanhals: Thanks Alan Hope you're doing well today.
Alan Babbitt: Hanging in there, looking at the snow outside, it doesn't seem like lacrosse weather, but after the last few winters I guess anytime is lacrosse, based on just itching to play. It's been nearly a year, I think, since you guys last played a match. How would you describe — is it excitement, anxiousness, eagerness for you and your team to finally be able to play again?
Michael Schanhals: We are so fired up to be together again and to be playing again so it has been just a treat for us to have an opportunity to get out on the field. Regardless of what the weather's doing you can just see the smiles on the guys faces and just a good vibe all the way through the program right now, because we're doing what we love to do.
Alan Babbitt: It'd be hard to remiss before we talk about what's coming this spring. not only looking back on a special lacrosse team, but a special senior class that, unfortunately, due to the pandemic lost the chance to have one more full season together. You guys were off to a 3-0 start and eagerly anticipating a chance to repeat as MIAA champions when the season was canceled. Talk about that senior class, they elevated the program with getting to winning that MIAA regular season championships and getting the MIAA tournament title and playing in the NCAA tournament and playing a very competitive match in that postseason debut just your thoughts on that senior class and what they meant to this program and Hope College.
Michael Schanhals: Well, I just got a little chills hearing you describe what those guys did for our program and just a really dynamic group of people and fun to work with, but also to win wit. We had to learn, we had a lot of talent, I think, eight of them started when they were freshmen now it's that's a shift for us and, and it was a feeling-out process they were they were so obviously talented and they over the course of their time together learned to play together really really well so to have that interrupted, and really clicking when things got disrupted obviously do the pandemic that almost didn't seem real at that time so when we left school at felt like well we said we'll see in two weeks, we're going to take a pause, we pause at that point and time and then now obviously that turned into quite a bit more. The mission that they were on to graduate from Hope College right, grow and as a human being and, as a person get a great education, all those things happened right. The lacrosse part is super important to us, but we know that's frosting, that stuff, that part. We did miss out on a little bit of that. But I'm so proud of those guys. Scott Brooks. Drew Pawlanta. Marshall VanBelkum. Andrew Caris. Max Kuiper. Gareth Ulmer. Rocco Mularoni. Andrew Pavey. Nathaniel Hentschel. And some guys that we had in that cohort that didn't make it all the way through to their senior year. Kyle Gaines. Sean Gliebe, some really great people that we had an opportunity to work with. We happened to win some championships and that was really fun obviously more fun to win than not, but were a little bummed that they didn't get the opportunity to do it again, but by the same token, were so proud of them. To be able to honor them when they come back to campus some time, I was missing Senior Day and some things like that are that are big moments in their lives and good reflective moments for us on the coaching staff because we appreciate all of it, like all the study and all the work at all the practice and all the extra and all the time together.
Alan Babbitt: What was it about this group in your mind that made them special where they were able to not only have the Hope College experience, but then they get this extra frosting, compete at a high level and really accomplish and things that hadn't been accomplished, yet in your short history collectively as a group? What made those seniors that senior class really stand out.
Michael Schanhals: Well, I think some of the seeds for what they accomplished were laid with the class before them.I would go back to Wade Hoag, his class, in sort of just a shift like 'hey we're here to compete and we're here to have just the absolute best time that we can have together.' What's special about this class thta graduated last year is that they lived into that really, really well. Those guys are tight and they enjoyed each other's company. They had each other's backs and, and so couldn't be more proud of all the guys that have played for us, championship or no championship. These guys they had something special in terms of their cohesiveness and how much they enjoyed their time together. That rubs off on all of us, so I am really grateful that we have the group that we have this year, because those guys passed that on to us, even though the seniors from last year aren't with us every day, we can feel them with us every day, right now, so I think that's a big deal.
Alan Babbitt: You have some incoming freshmen this year's team that lost a high school season as well, and then you got returners who lost their season as well, so there's some similarities there. There are some differences. How we're able to gather and work together and all these different things we've all had to deal with the pandemic? How have you tried to build the culture, this year to obviously try to build on what's been done by those that came before you and with all the different things that we have to contend with right now.
Michael Schanhals: There's a certain amount of compartmentalization that we've had to do on all of our lives, due to the circumstances, and so it is such a treat to move out of your isolatedness and get back together with your team. I think none of these freshmen take being able to put a helmet on and play for granted at all, if there's sort of a sideways blessing to this whole situation that we've been dealing with it's that it's like things that we might normally take for granted, are now precious to us and so we've got a super group of incoming freshmen, they have totally got what the program right away, everybody has each other's backs. The veterans we always organize it so that there's a veteran with a new guy as buddies, and we have squads and squad leaders to keep things organized and just make sure that they're supported, which Hope College does in general, just trying to give them every opportunity to have a great time. The couple hours a day we get to gather is a special part of their day so I think they get they get what a privilege, it is to play, because that was taken away from them due to the circumstances way beyond our control. I would also say that it was pretty unique I think at Hope College they had an opportunity to be at college, they had an opportunity to be in a class and it may be a little bit different than it normally would be, but Hope College did an outstanding job of making this fall semester happen for our kids. They've worked tirelessly to make sure that we have everything we need to have the most successful season possible this spring too, and I could not be more grateful or impressed with the leadership right now.
Alan Babbitt: If I were to watch you practice does it look different than practice pre-pandemic? Have you had to make any adjustments in terms of how you practice and how you prepare your team, and make the most out of that time that you have together>
Michael Schanhals: We were lucky to have a little bit longer time in the fall together, so there was a little bit different pace. We also had a stipulation that there weren't any drop-ins or sort of casual get-togethers so that made whatever time we had together more valuable, I think, so we got an awful lot done in the fall. Tanya Gruppen in the athletic training staff just makes everything, so clear to us, she's such a great communicator. Yes, we're going to wear masks today, when we line up we're going to stand by these cones. There have been some adjustments, but we have a saying that's water off a duck's back, we just roll with it and we'll keep smiling and play. it was a little bit of a process at first, for us to sort of ramp up like is this going to work? is this okay? We're to the point now where it pretty much looks like a regular practice, except for maybe when we break into squads a debrief something they're socially distanced, they have a mask on so other than that it's pretty much a straightforward practice plan like we would normally be able to develop we're lucky because we're outside. I think the transmission risk of COVID it was a high risk for it at first, and then it got moved down, as they learned more about it, and when we saw that a fall, It wasn't something that was happening at practice, practice was a pretty safe place to be outside running around having fun and a healthy thing so we're we feel really lucky that. Out of the 24 hours of the day it's two hours out of our day they're normal.
Alan Babbitt: Obviously, a challenge when you have a great senior class like you did is you've got to find new people, and then there are new opportunities to get on the field and contribute. Talk about this year's team and what, when we're finally able to see you play, we're going to see out on the field.
Michael Schanhals: When you have a real competitive practice every day, the guys who are there are so hungry to get their opportunity. What happened last year, too, is we like to play a lot of guys, we have a very deep roster. We want to use that depth, that speed, that athleticism. The side benefit of that is everybody's involved, everybody has something they've got a mission they're out there hunting. They're making something happen. These younger guys are going to grow this season that just got completely smoked in the process, too, so when those guys came back, they were so hungry to improve. Our fall work was really, really productive for them. Now, obviously, the next step is to test that against some other competition, too, but we're really lucky to have a very talented and deep group of young players that we get a really good look and practice, every day. We feel like we're ready for games, but we also know that, once the games are on our growth and learning opportunities are just going to accelerate that much more. We're really excited about that. We've got some outstanding leaders that have been here the whole time growing, learning, contributing, having a great time being part of it. Our seniors Adam Bell, Colton Warren, Peter Reynolds, Luke Elder, Our leadership team, Will Cunnington, Jake Maibecher, Brayden Blackburn, Andrew Wiggins, Andrew Conlon, Johnny Mann, these guys have done a great job of just making sure everybody's got their nose pointed in the right direction and they're going full speed, so our captains this year Luke Elder, Jack Radzville, Tucker Martinez and Liam Cunningham have been just really good patient leaders. The young guys, I think, feel like they have their back so it's been really nice for me as a head coach to work with these young men, just an outstanding group of people all the way through our roster right now so we're super excited to start playing. We cannot wait to get going and our first game in the conference is against Calvin, which is our big rival and we just are so pumped about that I get chills thinking about it, right now.
Alan Babbitt: With obviously every sport there are different ways that depth can have an impact, a positive impact on a team. In lacrosse, what does that afford you or give you an opportunity to impact the game?
Michael Schanhals: Well, the first thing is tempo and practice right. If you're going to play fast and you only just decide to play fast once a week that's probably not going to work very well, so we can play fast in practice and make good decisions at speed. That's really, really important Okay, so if you got a group of dudes that are operating at 100 miles an hour and a group of Dudes that are going 60 miles an hour it's tough. We've got a bunch of guys right now that are just really getting after it, and so we're getting a good look every single day. Because that's a strength of ours, we want to absolutely develop that as best we can, so we try to do that and we try to make sure that it's fun to play at that pace. That's not without some challenges right, because if you're going to play fast you're going to make a lot of mistakes, but we look at that, in practice, as a benefit because we know we have to make mistakes to learn and in order to do that, we have to put ourselves in stressful situations right. We want to try to turn that dial up so it's uncomfortable every day. It's like we said earlier, water off a duck's back that's just that's how we do it all the time and, yes, so it's some stuff's going to go sideways and we're going to soak it and move on to the next thing quickly and directly as possible, so these guys have done a great job. Being together as teammates they've done a great job trying to develop themselves as good teammates and we're super, super proud of the work that they've done in that regard.
Alan Babbitt: The respect for your program for your fellow coaches, they made gave you the top spot in the MIAA preseason coaches poll. This league you guys know well, in terms of how challenging it is. First, how do you deal with being the team that people want to beat and put a big mark on their schedule, because they know what that a win over you guys would mean. Then what are your how you see this league shaping up this spring. You haven't seen each other, probably in a year either so there's going to be a lot of unknowns for everyone.
Michael Schanhals: The scouting this year is a real challenge right, so we don't have a whole lot of film in the can from last year, what our roster is going to look like, with the additional year of NCAA eligibility. Teams are just posting their rosters right now so we're trying to get a handle on Okay well 'Who's new then?'I think it's going to be interesting to play, so to effectively to win the conference title you're going to need to beat a team three times potentially right, ideally right, because we want to win every game That is a unique challenge, more like a basketball coach faces than lacrosse coach in a normal season, because usually just play a team once and then maybe again in the conference, so it's not without its unique challenges for us. It's nice sign of respect to get votes like that, but now we have to go do it, so that's the exciting part. That's the weird thing about winning a championship. As soon as that's over it's like okay next. This hiatus has maybe helped me reflect on what we did a little bit more. We're always trying to drive improvement and get better and, but it was nice to sort of take a breath and go 'wow that was really cool, that was super fun and what a great group of people that we got to spend time with. We've got a lot of returners on our team right now that know what to do, they know what it takes their champions, and they want more of it and so they're very hungry and that's driving them and they know the faster that the new guys get it get up to speed, the better we're going to be as a team. We're really excited to jump into league competition in March, which is also a new that's a new thing for us as well because it's a double round robin this year. It did not escape our attention that not every coach in the league voted us first this year, so were we definitely took note of that.
Alan Babbitt: What makes this league challenging? What have you seen as far as the growth of this league that's producing some very high quality lacrosse?
Michael Schanhals: I'm so proud of our League, obviously my history and Hope lacrosse goes, it predates the MIAA. When I see MIAA lacrosse I still pinch myself excited for the fact that we are where we are right now. In terms of the growth and development of the sport there's better and better players coming out of the state of Michigan and most of those kids do play in our League, which I think is fantastic for the growth of the game. Our league provides a ton of opportunities for kids to take it to the next level, get a great education and continue their lacrosse careers. I have a really good relationship and bond with the other coaches in the league, we're in a unique place sort of tucked up here in Michigan and some of the guys have come from other places and other lacrosse traditions. It's a good group of men that are my colleagues in the league and I just really enjoy coaching alongside them and against them I'm buddies with those guys most every day of the year, we'll see each other at recruiting events or summer tournaments or this thing or that are at a meeting. Our collegiality is outstanding. We're very fortunate. We know that we need to situate ourselves in a better spot like top to bottom, our league needs to get more competitive at the NCAA level they have reconfigured the regions for the NCAA tournament we're probably in a position where we're still only going to get the automatic qualifier, not an at large bid yet, like some of our other teams, like our basketball teams, if they don't win the conference title there they still have a chance at an at large, we're not to that place yet in our league. I think all of the coaches in the MIAA they get that and we're working to change that so it has become very, very competitive a great place to play. It is just a ton of fun to be involved in it. We're very pleased with where we're situated right now.
Alan Babbitt: You've enjoyed lacrosse here at Hope College as a player and then as a club coach and now varsity coach. Lacrosse has been a sport that really would be considered I think in emerging sport in the last 10, 15 years, 20 years, maybe in the United States. Where did the love of the game start with you? How did you get involved?
Michael Schanhals: Lacrosse is the fastest growing sport across the country and, and it has been on that trend for quite a while now. It's not surprising to me. I was really lucky to start playing lacrosse in college. Which is a little bit strange, these days, a lot of kids grow up with a stick in their hand like I would have grown up with a hockey stick in my hand or a baseball glove or basketball or whatever sport was happening at that point in time so as as an athlete. The first time I got to play lacrosse I was like this is awesome this is so much fun. I was a punt returner and it felt like oh everybody's chasing me trying to kill me, this is so exciting I love this. I was hooked from the very first time that I had an opportunity to play. My best friend growing up all my days Tom Feely and I were coming out for the team at the same time in college and Tom Kuiper and Greg Vinstra were the captains and they really brought us up we had a really good team that year, and it was really fun to be able to jump on and contribute. It was just such a great time. I didn't anticipate necessarily that it would take over my whole athletic life, and it certainly hasn't been I love sports of all types, but I do remember calling my dad and just telling him hey This is awesome you got it you got to find out about this, and this is something. I shared my love of sports with my dad. He reminded me of this like he said remember when you called me, and said I think this is something that I really want to do. It was a big opportunity I'm so proud every time I put a Hope lacrosse shirt on which I'm wearing one right now just because I know how fortunate I was to come up at that time. Tommy and I were named captains, for the following year. It was a huge cathartic experience for me, to be just a dude and playing versus having some responsibility and some leadership. To be honest I didn't really look at myself like that I was just the guy at someone who love to play. Tohave that responsibility really opened my eyes to what was possible, not just for our young team at that time, but also, personally for me it showed me a different part of myself that I didn't really necessarily know that I had at that point in time. We had a really super tough schedule in those days in those days of lacrosse like if you played lacrosse pretty much anybody would play anybody, there was an opportunity to get a game going, because it was so much more rare. We had some epic spring break trips down south, there was a big tournament down there and it was Division I, II and III teams. You said we were a club team we didn't really look ourselves as club team were the only team we had. We even played a group of old men, once a year, the Grand Rapids lacrosse club. When I graduated I started playing for those guys and boy, they were good like they just absolutely thrashed us and we'd be running around like crazy and they would just pass the ball beautifully pass pass pass goal. I was like we should probably take notes from these guys so it was just so much fun to play the sport at that time. It has continued to be a real exciting thing to watch it grow. Watching both of my boys be able to have a stick in their hand when they were little guys and play their whole lives has been really fun and they love it and it's been really neat for me to be able to see them thrive and grow like that, too. I just I'm so grateful for that. When I started coaching, then I was actually finishing up at Hope College finishing up a couple of credits and working and I was visiting a friend in my old dorm. I hadn't lived in this dorm for like two years and I was visiting a friend there and they said hey Michael has a phone call for you now, and those days, the phone was on the wall. it's a total coincidence that I was even in the vicinity, but they said hey someone's on the phone for you and I was like what that's that's weird ?I picked this thing up it's Rick Morris from East Grand Rapids. They want to interview me for a coaching job and I still can't explain, how that would call that all went down but somehow I got the job head coach East Grand Rapids, absolutely loved coaching there. After I graduated I started to work for the Grand Rapids Press as a journalist and was just completely smitten by the coaching bug, had a sense that I probably just because of the life that entails I needed to go and credential myself as a teacher so that I could do that more so, so I did. I went back and got teaching credentials and then have been doing a little bit of both ever since. I feel I feel really lucky and I'm so glad that I picked that call up, that time changed my life.
Alan Babbitt: Now you continue your teaching career, you're at North Muskegon.Ii'll probably sell you short in terms of what you teach but following you on Twitter, literature is a big part of what you do Talk about that side of your life and how you try to make a difference with students that way.
Michael Schanhals: As I learned to get a teaching certificate was a little bit harder than just having studied a lot of English and philosophy in college so I was not able to have a teachable minor, which was a requirement. I had a double major in English and philosophy, so I had to get elementary certification, which is a real blessing as well, so consequently, I'm certified to teach K through 12 and have actually taught every grade from K through 12 in my career. Mostly the last 20 years or so it's been high school English and mostly seniors at this point. I taught middle school for a long time. I teach senior English, which is the required course for graduation so everybody has to take that unless they elect to take AP Lit, which I also teach. Small school. I teach some American literature too, which was my emphasis. I love to read. I love to share that with my students. I think I'm so crazy about sports that if I didn't have some balance I would get way too way too competitive for the athletic part of the day. it's been good for me to be able to do both and thankful to Hope for allowing me to do that so. I still coach a little bit of basketball so i've been a basketball coach here my whole entire career here, which is down approaching 30 years here. The dead period for the NCAA is November and December from the end of fall ball to wouldn't we start back up, so there's eighth grade basketball in that window and I still coach eighth grade basketball. I just can't help that so I just really love the interaction, I think I learned so much from playing sports and just love it. To be able to share that and then also create a relationship with people so that you can be pushed intellectually, at the same time is everything I've ever wanted to do professionally. I'm so grateful that I have this opportunity for sure.
Alan Babbitt: Well, lastly, I can't help but ask you to give us an assignment obviously this pandemic is allowed a lot of time for reading if you were to recommend someone listening hey You should read this, this is a good read when you have some extra free time that we do an occasion.
Michael Schanhals: I'll tell you what that's a great question but it's a subject for a whole series of podcasts. I'll try to keep it short. I just finished a book by Todd Goldberg. It's called 'Low Desert', which is gangster stories and the reason I picked it up is because I like reading the Don Winslow stuff, and so Don Winslow recommended it. I was like well I'll check it out I'll look at it so I've been in a little bit of a lull, which I think is pretty common during this pandemics like we're bingeing Netflix shows and stuff like that and not necessarily unplugging and reading. I think that's probably pretty natural. This was a collection of short stories and that suited my short attention span and short. I'm with my class right now of seniors we're looking at Jon Krakauer his book Missoula. That's been an excellent discussion starter for us. We're also reading the Iliad at the same time, so some classics. I'm more reading that to them than they're picking it up and reading it themselves. We're always open to something new, so we give a lot of choice, so we just encourage people to find something that they're into. I'll see if I can recommend something.
Alan Babbitt: I mainly following my daughter, she is in the PATH English Lit class at Hope. I am following her whatever she's reading and discussing. They've been working on poetry and remembering some things that are back in the brain from my day. She's a sixth-grader. I probably won't have much time to read these next two months but that's all right because we will have some Hope sporting events to be able to see and stat and do all those fun things.
Michael Schanhals: We definitely have some sports happening, which is wonderful. The PATH program is amazing. Our youngest son was in that, in English, and it was just such a great experience for him and really ignited his passion for literature, which I was happy to see. Good luck to her; that's super fun. It doesn't need to be long but just if you can read a poem out loud to her, I bet she would just absolutely love it, so I have a whole list I'll email. I found with older kids that they don't mind. We all love to hear a good story.
Alan Babbitt: That's a great idea I appreciate that. Being a father that's important stuff and we got to make time for that. Even though we spend a lot of time together, it can be easy not to take full advantage. I will look forward to that and that grateful to spend this time with you Michael on the Orange and Blue Podcast. I appreciate the time. I know you busy getting ready. March 3 vs. Aurora is the first match on the schedule. Home opener at five o'clock and everyone put that on your calendars and be able to at least watch it online. Fingers crossed sooner and later, you can see a lacrosse match in person. Thanks Michael and good luck this season.
Michael Schanhals: Thank you so very much and I hope you have a great day.
